icfworldhomes inc..... scam?

if anyone had been paying attention to the website, it is saying that Larry Telford has 35 years experience in construction, about 18 of those years were spent working with insulated concrete forms and the icfworldhomes business itself just started this year. But I guess if you're only willing to read half of a sentence then I could see how that would confuse you.

Now I see how rumours get started.

Anyhow, as someone said, the people have been in the business of building ICF homes (that by the way simply stands for Insulated Concrete Form) for some years. ICF is not new however, the ICF World Homes vision is an idea whose time is long over due.

I am not entirely sure if you can truly own or build an ICF home anywhere in the world but you can always take the $ and buy a conventional home or payoff a mortgage or buy a condo if you don't want a house or simply spend your earnings/gains if you enjoy paying rent.

I am sure that the ICF World Homes people have only the best interests of all at heart. It seems like just about anything today is a scam. Is working 40 hrs a week for $500 while the owner of any given company makes $1500 off your labour a scam? Think about it, it is all about perception.

We have all had negative experiences, we have all lost money at some point in our lives. There is a simple philosophy to abide by and that is if you can't afford to loose it don't use it! Scam or no scam. It is like Anthony Robbins once said, "what if it worked!"

Originally Posted by IREE I am not entirely sure if you can truly own or build an ICF home anywhere in the world but you can always take the $ and buy a conventional home or payoff a mortgage or buy a condo if you don't want a house or simply spend your earnings/gains if you enjoy paying rent.

You cut the legs out from under your whole argument right there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IREE
I am not entirely sure if you can truly own or build an ICF home anywhere in the world but you can always take the $ and buy a conventional home or payoff a mortgage or buy a condo if you don't want a house or simply spend your earnings/gains if you enjoy paying rent.



You cut the legs out from under your whole argument right there.

___________________________

WoW dude you are really negative!

But that's okay, it would add one more travel destination to see a house (of any kind) built in the middle of the Mojave!
Moreover, if an ICF home is too sound proof or energy compliant for you, build a shack!

The builder was a numbered corp for the 35 years before restructuring the marketing corp with new name and a referral component, that's why you won't find any history with ICF World Homes.

I was introduced to ICF World Homes by a business group that makes it their daily business to travel all over Canada to purchase and run companies. They know what they're doing. They don't get involved with scams or even MLM.

These businessmen (numbers people) said "No Thanks" at first glance, but after original hesitation went in and around, asked all the probing questions, did the due diligence, and came out satisfied that it was a legit business. They now sell half their packages for ICF.

Phone them up and ask your questions. Ask who does their accounting and legal work. Take a look at the numbers. See some of the past homes they've built. Don't just sit behind a keyboard and cry "witch" as the previous poster said.

Originally Posted by Iree Quote: Originally Posted by IREE I am not entirely sure if you can truly own or build an ICF home anywhere in the world but you can always take the $ and buy a conventional home or payoff a mortgage or buy a condo if you don't want a house or simply spend your earnings/gains if you enjoy paying rent. You cut the legs out from under your whole argument right there. ___________________________ WoW dude you are really negative! But that's okay, it would add one more travel destination to see a house (of any kind) built in the middle of the Mojave! Moreover, if an ICF home is too sound proof or energy compliant for you, build a shack!

You're the one who said it not me. As with all of these MLM deals, it clearly reveals your view that the product itself is little more than a straw man and secondary to promoting participation in the MLM-type program.

Originally Posted by Unregistered The builder was a numbered corp for the 35 years before restructuring the marketing corp with new name and a referral component, that's why you won't find any history with ICF World Homes.

What was the name of the numbered corporation?
What was the dba name?
Where and when was it incorporated?
Who were the principals?
What was the business of the corporation?

I was introduced to ICF World Homes by a business group that makes it their daily business to travel all over Canada to purchase and run companies. They know what they're doing. They don't get involved with scams or even MLM. These businessmen (numbers people) said "No Thanks" at first glance, but after original hesitation went in and around, asked all the probing questions, did the due diligence, and came out satisfied that it was a legit business. They now sell half their packages for ICF.

Unattributed, undemonstrated anecdotes like this are just that and commonly made for every online investment. What's the name of this group? The focus of the web site clearly is as a form of MLM program so it's hard to align your statement that they have no interest in MLM.

ICF is not a brand or other distinct fanchise, it's a general construction material and method. The presence of information regarding ICF generally tells you nothing about this company and its program in particular.

Phone them up and ask your questions. Ask who does their accounting and legal work. Take a look at the numbers. See some of the past homes they've built. Don't just sit behind a keyboard and cry "witch" as the previous poster said

Relying on the operators themselves alone is not a particularly good means for due dilligence.

Can they provide independently audited financials?

The model they suggest would appear to be classified as an investment and as terms/returns and membership is openly available to the public there are related regulations that must be addressed. Have they filed registration for such or do they hold determinations that securities laws do not apply? It would appear not since required elements are not present (e.g., appropriate disclaimers, registration numbers, non-public access to details of the opportunity, qualification requirements for investors, etc.).

Can they provide detailed information specifically identifying the principals (beyond names alone) and their backgrounds?

Why is all of the information on the site tailored to what would appear to be an MLM-type program to the virtual exclusion of any specific information regarding the product itself?

They appear to only accept payment through AlertPay which is an anonymous and non-recoverable payment system common to HYIP-type sites. Why no conventional payment methods?

Originally Posted by Unregistered As with all of these MLM deals???

Come on Unregistered, you can do better than to make generalizations.

Originally Posted by Iree Come on Unregistered, you can do better than to make generalizations.

Generalizations? It's an MLM that revolves around selling units. And a fairly complicated one at that with up-front, monthly, and other fees, requirements to sell the plan to others, unspecified guidelines that are required to be met for payment, additional costs to maintain accounts and for legal fees for transfer of money, etc. Very similar in structure to a number of others but with the ICF housing slant, which again appears to be just a straw man since there's really nothing even related to ICF involved.

If the idea was to make it so complicated that people don't understand what's really going on, then I think they've succeeded.

People can read the details for themselves.

ICF World Homes Business Plan Welcome to the path of our simple Home Ownership Plan. As a Member of ICF World Homes you benefit every time a new Kit Plan is sold. All Kit Plans have a maximum number of Building Block Units. ICF World Homes Gain Shares, a portion of its profits from each sale of Building Block Units sold. The effect is felt throughout the whole Company’s Membership, worldwide. Every Member becomes an important part of a Global Community, where everyone benefits. The secret has been discovered and we are now entering a world of peace, health, wealth and happiness. Our Business Plan is easy to follow. Choose the Plan that is right for you, knowing that you can upgrade at anytime, to a higher Kit Plan. All of our Home Kit Plans include the Building Block Plan, so you will benefit from each and every Kit Plan sold. After 32 Company Kit Plan Sales the same as yours or higher, have taken place after you, you will receive Gain Sharing and the next month of 32 new Company sales, your Monthly Product Purchase will be covered by our Gain Sharing Commission Program. It’s that simple. You are now part of an automated system that will track your progress of your Membership ID # Volumes, to your Super Energy Efficient ICF World Home, built to your specifications, and paid for in cash from our Gain Sharing Program. Our Concept has been designed to reduce the housing shortage of the world. ICF World Homes Members will enjoy the time and the freedom that comes with owning their own home, mortgage free and a residual income to fulfill their dreams by being part of a Global Community. How Global and Personal Gain Sharing is achieved. 1. Every plan contains our Building Block Plan. Whether you start with our BB Plan, (Building Block Plan) or our executive Diamond Home Kit Plan, you benefit from the BB Plans sold. 2. After 32 Company Kit Plan Sales, have taken place after you, the same as yours or a higher Kit Plan, you will receive Gain Sharing the first month and after the 2nd month of 32 new Company sales, your Monthly Commitment/Product Purchase will be covered by our Gain Sharing Commission Program. Your Gain Share Commission will continue to increase up to the maximum number of Building Block Units allowed for your Plan. We have supplied a Chart to show you how it works. 3. Start with the Home Kit Plan that best fits your budget and you may upgrade to any of the other Home Kit Plans, when you feel the time is right for you. 4. Each ICF World Homes Kit Plan has its own Volume based on the Monthly Commitment / Product Purchase amount. Every month, every Home Kit Plan Member pays their Product Purchase amount, maintaining your volume grows and you progress every month. 5. Starting with the Building Block Kit Plan, allows you to benefit from every Building Block Kit Plan sold and since every ICF World Home Kit Plan includes the BB Kit Plan, your Gain Sharing will grow by every Home Kit Plan sold. When you start with a Diamond Home Kit Plan, you will Gain Share in all Home Kit Plan Volumes. In summary the Diamond will Gain Share Volumes with every ICF World Home Kit Plan sold, therefore by starting with a Diamond Kit Plan you will benefit from all of the Gain Sharing Volumes. 6. Gain Sharing accumulated from the 32 credits from other Home Kit Plans will be applied towards your Monthly Commitment / Product Purchase, starting in the 2nd month, thereby reducing your monthly payment by the amount of Gain Sharing Commission you received that month. 7. Share ICF World Homes Kit Plans with everyone, together we will build a world where everyone who ever dreamed of owning a home of their own, mortgage free may live a life they dream of having. 8. Your Membership is willable to your family and or heirs to insure a quality life for them that you have created for them for generations to come. Business Agreement Between ICF World Homes and Member 1. ICF World Homes is custom home building company, sharing the profits of our Building Block Units with our Members for the purpose of building energy efficient homes. 2. The Member purchases a Home Kit Plan and the accumulation of Building Block Units purchased through the monthly product purchase will begin to increase for the construction of the Member’s Home Kit Plan purchased. 3. ICF World Homes maintains a “Building Block Account” representing the wholesale value of the unfinished Building Blocks needed to match all ICF Form Units sold. 4. The Member agrees to a monthly purchase for the Member’s chosen Kit Plan purchased, until such time as the funds from the Gain Sharing Commission covers the monthly cost of the Member’s Home Kit Plan. All Kit Plans are to be paid 1-month in advance. It takes 2 months of 32 Company sales of your chosen Kit Plan, each month to cover your monthly Kit Plan cost. 5. The Member is responsible to open a “Dream Home Account” at their bank to which funds from Gain Sharing Commission will be deposited by ICF World Homes. 6. A disposable income commission is included in monthly deposits to Member’s Dream Home Account. This amount will vary depending on the Home Kit Plan the Member has purchased. Disclaimer * All charts and figures relating to Gain Sharing Commission are based on actual sales volumes of Kit Plans monthly product purchase sold. All charts shown represent best efforts only and may vary in actuality in an ongoing basis. The company reserves the right to change charts as they are monitored to represent actual growth. 7. Members are responsible to maintain the funds for the Member’s chosen Home Kit Plan for the purpose of building an ICF World Home or paying off an existing mortgage or to use the funds for a renovation or addition or to purchase a pre-existing energy efficient home in accordance with ICF World Homes standards. (see 8 — 10 for details regarding income tax) 8. ICF World Homes will be making deposits to the Member’s “Dream Home Account” as Gain Sharing Commission from the sale of Building Block Units are credited to the Member’s ID # on a monthly basis. 9. ICF World Homes will match the balance of the Members “Dream Home Account” balance to the amount that is in the account at the time that the Building Block Units MAX out for the Member’s chosen Home Kit Plan. ICF World Homes will only match the Gain Sharing commission designated to build your Dream Home. GPT/Fast Start or Disposable Commissions are not matched by the ICF World Homes. 10. The Business Agreement and the Rules & Regulations may be periodically updated to incorporate any revised policies and procedures that are deemed as an advantaged to the Member and ICF World Homes. The company website will be updated as changes take place. 11. Read carefully. This Business Agreement shall be binding to all parties if it may change hands. All parties now and in the future will be held to the contents of this Agreement in its entirety. Parts not valid may occur from time to time and will not affect any of the remaining parts and conditions. This Agreement will hold binding to all parties and Signatures including Liquidator (s) / Trustees) / Executor (s) / Administrator (s) of the Estate /Succession 12. By becoming a Member of ICF World Homes you hereby declare and acknowledge that your participation with ICF World Homes is not investment or any type of guaranteed securities in any form and ICF World Homes has made no such claim. The Member acknowledges that the Gain Sharing Commission is from the purchase of ICF Building Block Units. 13. It is understood all Members are to refrain from using any terminology that my give the impression of an investment or any type of securities promotion. Any Member discovered using such language is ground for termination without recourse. 14. As part of the Business Agreement, Members acknowledge, ICF World Homes to store or/ledger my block count until such time as I ask for my building block units to be delivered. Rules & Regulations (to form part of Business Agreement) ICF World Homes vision is to supply an opportunity for every person to have a home they can call their own without limitations as to location, country, terrain, age, style, size, or finish, mortgage free, without the burden of having to worry about taxes or upkeep. Through the development of a success business plan where every customer who chooses to participate in ICF World Homes will be assured a virtual success. Being an ICF World Homes Group Member 1-1 These Rules & Regulations are applicable to all ICF World Homes Members. 1-2 All ICF World Homes members are required to comply with all the Rules & Regulations contained in this document. ICF World Homes reserves the right to amend or alter these Rules & Regulations at any time without prior notice. It is the sole responsibility of all Members to ensure that they are familiar with all the current Rules & Regulations and all periodic amendments. Any amendments will only be done as an improvement for the benefit of the group. 1-3 An individual or company may submit more than one application for Home Kit Plan 1 through 6. Only one Building Block Kit Plan may be purchased per individual. 1-4 ICF World Homes reserves the right to accept or reject any new Member Application at its sole discretion. 1-5 All ICF World Homes Members (other than corporations) must be of legal age of majority in the Country, Province, Territory and or State jurisdiction in which they reside. 1-6 Applications must be filled out completely. You must have a Social Insurance Number or Social Security Number or other Identification number on the application. 1-7 In the case of minors, “IN TRUST” must be written along with the name of child and parent. 1-8 Due to the seriousness of this information, failure to provide correct legal information may result in immediate termination and forfeiting of all and any bonuses and benefits. 1-9 All corporations must be in compliance in the country in which they reside. 1-10 If you are an Incorporated Company you must also provide a Federal Taxation identification number. 1-11 Full payment must be made with the Application within a 72 hour time frame. PayPal - (Credit Cards accepted through PayPal include a 3.9 credit card processing fee) , Money Orders, Bank Drafts, Email Transfers or Bank Wire Transfers to our Company Bank Account, Electronic Payments for Scotiabank Customers. (Cheques uncertified will be held for 10 days and an NSF charge of $50.00 will apply to the Member. Cash given to Presenters must be accompanied by receipts - member receipt, presenter receipt and office receipt. A faxed copy of receipt will be accepted. 1-12 Transfer of any Member ID# is possible with written notice, and all necessary documentation (get in touch with Company for Transfer Package) for inheritance in a case of death. Please contact our Head Office for further information regarding this matter. 1-13 No existing Memberships may be sold without the expressed written consent from ICF World Homes. A standard release form must be completed and ICF World Homes has the option of redeeming that ID #. 1-14 ICF World Home has a 100% refund policy up to 30 days, less any commissions or bonuses earned. 1-15 ICF World Homes will place you into our Global donwline, as soon as your payment is cleared. 1-16 For each new Home Kit Plan generated by you, ICF World Homes will credit that sale of the Home Kit Plan or Monthly Commitment / Product purchase, to your ID #. Voluntary Down Grading Your Home Kit Plan 2-1 You are allowed to temporarily down grade your chosen Home Kit Plan down to a minimum of an Emerald Home Kit Plan’s Monthly cost, but you will then be only allowed to earn gain sharing as an Emerald Home Kit Plan. You may retain your positions in the original chosen Home Kit Plan up to 9 months. The company must be notified of your decision to only pay for a lower plan 30 days in advance of the commissionable month to be effected. Your position although in the other higher plans is still there, all positions below yours in those Plans will be compressed up to fill your position for commissionable purposes. You will have 9 months to reclaim your original position by making that plan’s monthly cost payment. By activating your original position with in the 9 months all the positions which where compressed up will be uncompressed to allow you your original position. Voluntary Termination 3-1 Anyone wishing to terminate his or her position may do so by written notice to ICF World Homes Head Office and submitting of the proper forms. Call Head Office for the paperwork. 3-2 A member may be terminated if failure to comply with any of the Business Agreement and the Rules and Regulations. 3-3 Termination of ICF World Homes will result in you agreeing to forfeit your matching bonus from ICF World Homes. 3-4 Your Building Block Units purchased are yours at the time of termination. You may choose to take delivery or have the Building Block Units refunded at the wholesale unfinished price of the raw block, less a 20% restocking charge. Tax Information 4-1 No tax is deducted from any Gain Sharing Commission or Direct Sales commissions, that you receive from ICF World Homes. You are an Independent Representative/Distributor of ICF World Homes only. Press Inquiries and Advertising 5-1 Any inquiries made by press media or other parties must be immediately referred to ICF World Homes. Any violation of this provision will be grounds for immediate review or termination. 5-2 You may not use ICF World Homes in any advertising that is not approved by ICF World Homes. 5-3 Company approved Marketing tools are available through ICF World Homes Online Back Office available by download. Non approved materials are subject to Member termination if not approved. Applications 6-1 ICF World Homes will accept Online applications only, through our website. Appropriate payment is due upon receipt of application. (72 hours from sign up process) 6-2 Failure to pay each month will disqualify you from receiving any Gain Sharing Commission or receiving any Company generated sales. 6-3 Your Gain Sharing Commission will be used to pay monthly product purchase with balance forwarded to you. ICF World Home DREAM ACCOUNTS 7-1 When 32 Company Kit Plan Sales, have been generated after you, the same as yours or a higher Kit Plan, you will receive Gain Sharing for those sales the first month. With a new 32 Company Kit Plan sales in the second month your Monthly Product Purchase will be covered by your Gain Sharing Commission. Any balance owing are to be paid to ICF World Homes by the member until such time as the Gain Sharing covers the full amount and the balance will be deposited into your Dream Account. 7-2 The Member is responsible to open a “Dream Home Account” at their bank to which funds from Gain Sharing commission, GPT, Fast Start or Disposable Commissions will be deposited by ICF World Homes. 7-3 Members are responsible to maintain the funds for the building of an ICF World Home, or paying off an existing mortgage or to use the funds for a major renovation or addition or to purchase a pre-existing energy efficient home in accordance with ICF World Homes standards. 7-4 All funds used from the Dream Home Account are used only with the consent of ICF World Homes for the designated purpose as to the ICF World Homes Guidelines, other than the allowed disposable income and any bonuses. 7-5 ICF World Homes will be making monthly deposits to the Member’s “Dream Home Account”. All commission cheques or direct deposits have a $2.00 processing fee. 7-6 ICF World Homes will match the balance of the Members “Dream Home Account” balance to the amount that is in the account at the time that the Building Block Units MAX out for the Member’s chosen Home Kit Plan. Only to the amount that has been paid from Gain Sharing Commission by ICF World Homes are matched. Any monies withdrawn by the Member in excess of the allowed Disposable Commission will not be matched by ICF World Homes. 7-7 All cost related to the completion of your ICF World Homes plan or plans will be the responsibility of your Dream Account. Check with your Personal Director for complete details. 7-8 This Dream Account must be used for the purpose of building an ICF World Home or paying off an existing mortgage or to use the funds for a major renovation or additions or to purchase a pre-existing energy efficient home in accordance with ICF World Homes standards. 7-9 ICF World Homes matching bonus ends when the maximum Building Block Units for the Members Home Kit Plan has been achieved. The Member may choose to continue building his/her Dream Account from Gain Sharing Commission, by continuing to purchase Building Block Units. 7-10 Each Home Kit Plan has a maximum number of Matching Building Blocks credits. As you use your Matching Building Blocks Bonus, they will not be replaced. 7-11 Your Home Kit Plan will still remain intact and will generate Gain Sharing Commission for you into the future providing you maintain your monthly commitment/product purchase. 7-12 Gain Sharing Commission is on a best efforts basis, and is based on the actual sale of Building Block Units. 8-1 All Commissions and Direct Sales Commissions are calculated in Canadian Funds. 8-2 All pricing on all products are subject to change without notice. 8-3 All ICF World Home Kit Plans are based on Canadian funds, calculated in the currency of the country sold. 8-4 All monies expressed for Gain Sharing Commission are based on minimums and maximums and with all monthly commitments being met. Actual figures can change based on actual monthly volumes and actual monthly sales. Actual Gain Sharing Commission distributed are based on your Home Kit Plan you purchased. 8-5 Members are required to sell one ICF World Home Kit Plan to collect the ICF World Homes Gain Sharing in the first 60 days of Membership. Members wishing to follow our Business Plan, will be on target to achieve your Dream Home in as quick as 3 years by sharing and generating one Home Kit Plan sale per month in your first year and encouraging the new Home Kit Plan Members to follow our successful Business Plan. 8-6 Members acknowledge that ICF World Homes is a custom home building company and is able to build their home even before the Kit Plan has matured, as long as the Member has the financing in place to build the home. 8-7 Members acknowledge that ICF World Homes is in pre-launch. 8-8 The minimum amount of Matching Bonus a Member may request is $5000.00 in the Dream Account. The request for a matching bonus must be accompanied by a written outline and cost of the Project to be matched. Any and all Projects must fall within ICF World Homes Guidelines of acceptable criteria to receive the Matching Bonus The minimum cost to be paid by Member to ICF World Homes Legal Fee is $500.00. 8-9 All Matching Bonus funds are paid to Members Lawyer, after proof of Member’s Dream Home Account, has the required matching amount requested. Member’s funds and ICF World Homes Matching Bonus funds are sent directly to the Lawyer and all cost is paid for by the Member. 8-10 The acceptable use of Matching Bonus funds available for Income Tax with a 55% split for home/45% for tax split. I have read the Business Agreement and The Rules & Regulations and agree to all terms and conditions. Signature: ____________________ Date: ____________________ Signature: ____________________ Date: ____________________ REVISED May 3 2008

Just make that check out to Teddy Telford or Stella Heimstra!